Is It A Boy Thing?

[Bizzy Lizzy]

As most of you know I have two grandchildren who live very close by. GS is aged ten and GD is aged 8. They are both bright but there is an enormous difference between them academically. GD loves school and works hard, wants to please her teacher, gets things right most of the time, is on the top table for all subjects and shows other children what to do when she can. Her teachers always love her and say she is the perfect student. Okay then there is GS two years older. When he started school he was interested in learning and keen and enjoyed school. It is a good school and he was happy and settled. At some point (not sure exactly when) the work became boring (he said) and he lost interest. He does the minimum he can get away with and scrapes by, avoiding being in trouble for not doing anything,and he is the joker of the class and is popular. He has the quickest wit so is not dim. Everything he does is deemed "could do better" and nothing his parent do or say makes any difference. If they nag him about his homework or school work generally he gets very upset. He lacks motivation and, although he will take the Kent Test in September, I suspect he will probably not pass. I can see GD at the grammar no problem but wonder about his future as the local comprehensive is not the best. I know it is not all boys but many seem to go this way. Can anyone relate to this?

[aggie]

Oh yes , my youngest DS to a T ! he couldn't care less and got chucked from Uni because he was "bored " , his sisters took him in hand after that and he is doing well in the civil service ............. it is still "boring " but is motivated by his mates and has had some promotion and doing great , eldest GS is so laid back he is only interested in his guitar ............. really worries me , but they are both so loveable and kind , I get all my hugs and loving from them

[Plantaholic]

He sounds like my DS (who is now54) he always did enough to scrape by, I expect when things are important to your GS he will achieve it. Would he rather go to the grammar school or is he not bothered, because that is what made my son eventually focus was the grammar school was where he wanted to go.

[Bizzy Lizzy]

Yes Plant he would like to go to the grammar but not enough to actually put in the work needed. I think he hopes that by some miracle he will get there without doing much at all. He will get a shock I know and will probably be upset if some of his friends go there which they inevitably will. It is hard to watch him drift along thinking it will all work out okay when it is clear that a lot depends on education these days.

[Plantaholic]

It only needed us to spell it out to him that he started to work hard.

[Oma]

My DD was very academic and has risen to a very high standard she is now a Manager with Social Services putting care packages in for adults with Mental and physical problems she has two degrees one is in Art of all things its what she studied for first before going in the opposite direction with her life ,
My DS was another kettle of fish , he had no interest at all in education and was so laid back he was almost horizontal like your boy only interested in his guitar ,he was like this till he was 26 then he had a family to support and although he was never out of work he didn't push himself . Now he has his family he has risen in the ranks and again a manager ,still laid back but more motivated now .
GS1 is very academic he is 10 and like your GD BL, GS2 is very much like my DS no interest at all but is very bright and a brain that soaks up everything just keeps it to himself but if something interests him he gets very enthusiastic , GD is still a baby so no idea how she will be . I think at the end of the day as long as they work to there ability and are happy that's what matters

[Daisy]

BL - What incentives would make him put in the effort to pass the 11+? I know there's the moral high ground where we say they should work because they want to do their best, but in practice, it's sad to see a bright lad like your GS miss out because he didn't do the relatively small amount of work he would need to pass.

I saw so many students at college who trod the path your GS is on. They arrived at college at 16, delighted to be free of school - girls and boys! - with average-ish GCSE results, and most of them responded to the more adult environment and could at last see a reason to study and do their best. So all is not lost.

There were also a few who arrived with 10+ good GCSEs which they had achieved fairly easily and thought they could do the same for A Levels or IB - but couldn't. It was hard work to get them to see they were setting themselves up for failure. But what I learned over many years is that some people have to fail to succeed.

However, I can understand your worries, and I'm not brushing them away. He just needs a trigger to motivate him. Would it be possible for him to visit the grammar school and the comp to see what he thought of them both?

[Bizzy Lizzy]

I think there are school choice nights at some point Daisy but I wonder if this may come too late as the serious work had to started at the beginning of this school year and there is not much left of that now. The ridiculous thing also is that they are off for six weeks and then a week after going back they sit the test. Most kids do not do much in the six weeks summer holidays unless they are pushed really hard by their parents and GS does not respond at all well to being pushed so that will not happen. It is the incentive that is lacking and sadly there is no way to produce that in a ten year old that does not have it. I just wonder what it is that makes an enthusiastic five year old start school full of promise and very keen end up as an apathetic bored ten year old. Something is lost along the way.

[Nanto2girls]

Our eldest wasn't the least bit interested in anything at school.Then when he left at 15(he is 46 next month) he announced he wanted to join the army.No way did we think he would get in, but he did.
At 17, he was sent to Northern Ireland, but wasn't allowed to go onto the streets until he was 18, and he worked his way up to being in the bomb disposal unit.After his time in Northern Ireland was up, he did 6 months peace keeping duties in Falkland Islands.
So even though he didn't care much for school, we are/were proud of what he did achieve.

[Daisy]

BL - It does seem a bit silly to have the tests a week into the Autumn term. If he doesn't respond to being pushed, has anybody tried bribing him? A simple deal - "work hard and pass the exam and you'll get <whatever his biggest 'want' is at the moment>." I know there are all sorts of reasons why this isn't good parenting, but it sounds as though he's a bright boy who is going to miss out. It's sad that he was once so keen and eager to learn and has lost that enthusiasm, and I wonder if he found it too easy and got bored?

My DS1, now 43 says he never really 'got' school. He couldn't really see the point of all the useless stuff (his words) they had to learn. I think a lot of children think school is irrelevant to their lives. Is there any peer group pressure that's stopping him? Some children think it's 'cool' to be disinterested, bored and uncaring, at least on the surface.

[Plantaholic]

Wise words Jean

[Glammanana]

Bizzy Lizzy You could be talking about both my DSs they did not get into gear until they where about 14/15 and realised how important their time at school was,both left early and joined The Forces it was a career they both wanted and they both did so well.DS2 went straight away to Medical School to train as a field paramedic so he certainly had the brains and knowhow he was just not old enough at the time to put it into practice and yes I do think its a boy thing as we have just gone through the most agonising year with DGS1 and his walking away from his Law Degree Course with only 1 year to go,it is totally heart breaking but its not what he wants to do so what can we do to change his mind absolutley nothing I'm affraid.Both my boys did well and whilst they don't have high powered careers as such they are very happy with their work and have never ever been unemployed,thank goodness

[Daisy]

Glamm, I think you make a very important point when you say your sons don't have high-powered careers but are happy with their work and have never been unemployed.

We want our children and grandchildren to do well, but when you look carefully at that that means, it's probably that we want them to have interesting (to them) jobs that give them a reasonable standard of living, and the time and energy to have a happy family life. You don't need a PhD for any of those things. I saw a lot of very pushy parents pressurising their children at college - if they didn't get into at least a 'good' university they were doomed in their parents' eyes, and I often wondered how much of tis pressure was the parents wanting to be able to boast about my son at Oxford, or my daughter doing a Masters in Astrophysics!

I wanted my sons to go as far educationally as they could without it taking over their entire lives. They both went to what many people would have considered the easier universities and both got 2:1s while having a great social life. To me that was a good balance. But if they'd wanted to do say an apprenticeship at 16 or 18 I would have fully supported that. I'd have been less happy if they'd 'dropped out' and lazed around the house all day!!

[Bizzy Lizzy]

Yes Daisy again it is a boy thing - looking unconcerned and showing little interest to be "one of the gang" is part of the problem. I may think too deeply but I worry about putting too much emphasis on success as if he fails to get the result he wants he will feel like a "failure" and that label can stick with kids for years. He is a very sensitive lad and keeps a lot to himself which is not surprising with a bright, gregarious and constantly talking sister. He often seems in her shadow. My DS1 was clever but was so nervous at exam time that he never did well even though he had done the work and knew the answers. He did get 3 'A grade' science A levels but had to work very hard to get there. It striking a balance between encouraging him to do well and letting him know we will love him just the same if he doesn't do so well. The Kent Test is a hard one because they not only have to pass to go to the Grammar - as in our day - they have to be in the top 30 as well as there are so few Grammar school places.

[Daisy]

BL, It would be good if he could understand that some of his best mates are probably working hard behind the scenes to get to the Grammar school. It is an incredibly competitive system in Kent, I know, and I know Libra Gran has seen two of her GDs going through the same pressure. It's also hard when one sibling feels in the shadow of another. Different reasons, but we have a similar situation with our GS2, who is also 10. Do you see him on his own, ie without your GD? He might feel able to open up a bit to Granny where he perhaps wouldn't to Mum and Dad.

I feel sorry for children who are under too much pressure to succeed. They are children and deserve their childhood. There is also a scenario of a fear of success, odd as it sounds. Some very clever, able children will not do as well as they could because they are anxious about sustaining their success and living up to it., or it setting them apart from their peer group.

Of course, we grandparents can't help worrying, can we. xx